Jump to content


Photo

IOBitís Denial of Theft Unconvincing


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
235 replies to this topic

#201 exile360

exile360

    exile

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 16,013 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:12 AM

I never said they stole source code, I said the feature was just like FileASSASSIN in MBAM, big difference. I clarified it in my post above.
Samuel E Lindsey
Product Manager

Posted Image

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook

#202 GT500

GT500

    Mostly Cantankerous

  • Trusted Advisors
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,250 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Fortville, IN

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:14 AM

...

But I found it has nothing to do with Advanced SystemCare. In this forum, there is only one side, they think all of the product were stolen that I cannot agree. That's why I registered an account here.


I would recommend that, before arguing with security experts, that you do some of your own tests to see if you can prove that IOBit did not steal program code from other vendors in addition to their database.

I will say this much, because Bruce (our VP of Research) has already said this publicly: IOBit's software was oddly compatible with our database. Usually you cannot copy a database from one application to another, not just because of different file formats, but because the algorithms that the applications use are different. The fact that our database was copied so closely suggests, but does not prove, that they copied more than just the database.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, and against the worldly governors, the princes of the darkness of this world...


#203 DragonMaster Jay

DragonMaster Jay

    True Member

  • Honorary Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 379 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:17 AM

It's quite usual in China. People uses ADSL to connect to internet, they don't have actual IP but a virtual IP, so you will find that a lot of people are using the same IP.


Not so much. Most computers are assigned a Unique IP, and are on the same IP range as others. Computer do not have the same IP unless they are on the same server and have allowed a same IP.

IP addresses must be different, because they communicate binary numbers. Usually it is annoying to have the same IP, because of potential issues.

#204 Jim G

Jim G

    New Member

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 32 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:20 AM

Perhaps, but again, the real question is, why support a company that you yourself believe has committed theft in any way by using or promoting any of their software?

I never said they stole the code, but it really really looks that way. It was like a nauseating deja-vu when I played with 360. The more of the built in features I tried, the more I realized that everything in it was exactly like other well known programs. That upset me and no one else had commented on it, so I chose to do so.

I respect what you've said and I understand that it's entirely possible that I'm wrong about this, but the DB issue is a confirmed one (at least by you, and many users like you who have read the available information and/or done testing on their own to confirm it). That is the primary issue here, the other stuff that I posted was just an FYI for others to take a look at and try for themselves, that's why I listed the programs that they seemed to be stealing from or imitating to an uncomfortable degree (uncomfortable for me at least, but obviously not for yourself, which is fine, it's your computer and you choose the software that you will and won't use on it).


Well, thanks for understanding my first. I paid Advanced SystemCare Pro and I started to use it from 2006, and I found it's really a great product.

About IObit Security 360, I think they did wrong, but I'd like to give them one chance. Maybe you don't know something happend in China. Last year, Google PinYin typer program stolen the whole database from another Chinese company SouGo. This program is designed to help us type letters in Chinese, so there are many user need it, it has over 100 million download per year. So Google found it's quite a big market, but they don't have the Chinese character database, so they stolen it from other Chinese company. Another thing is that 3 years ago, when Kaspersky went into Chinese market, they stolen the virus database from JiangMing AV---another Chinese antivirus vendor. As their sample are mainly based on US and Euro, so they need Chinese virus sample, but they don't have enough time to get it, so they stolen from other vendor. In the end, Google just modify the database and then everything is over, the same as kaspersky, they just offer free license to users, and people forget it.

Well, that's what we user knows. Even Google and Kaspersky did this kind of things, so I just want to give them a chance.

#205 exile360

exile360

    exile

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 16,013 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:23 AM

Regarding IOBit 360: did anyone (including Jim G) ever happen to notice that aside from the actual scanner and the file deletion tool (2 features I commented as being similar to MBAM), all of the other "tools" are seperate exe's? Why if they were trying to make one comprehensive program, would there be a need for seperate executables for each one?

I submit as a possibility that they stole the code from the other softwares I mentioned and partially rewrote each one into a seperate executable and then bundled it all together with nothing more than links that call the other exe's from the main executable (IS360.exe).
Samuel E Lindsey
Product Manager

Posted Image

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook

#206 Jim G

Jim G

    New Member

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 32 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:25 AM

Not so much. Most computers are assigned a Unique IP, and are on the same IP range as others. Computer do not have the same IP unless they are on the same server and have allowed a same IP.

IP addresses must be different, because they communicate binary numbers. Usually it is annoying to have the same IP, because of potential issues.


Yes, it is in China. Do you know the so called GFW? (Great Fire Wall). We cannot visit some website if gov block it, as we use the same IP, they can monitor some kind of content. That' different from US. We cannot visit Youtube as there are too many videos from Tibet.

#207 Jim G

Jim G

    New Member

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 32 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:32 AM

Regarding IOBit 360: did anyone (including Jim G) ever happen to notice that aside from the actual scanner and the file deletion tool (2 features I commented as being similar to MBAM), all of the other "tools" are seperate exe's? Why if they were trying to make one comprehensive program, would there be a need for seperate executables for each one?

I submit as a possibility that they stole the code from the other softwares I mentioned and partially rewrote each one into a seperate executable and then bundled it all together with nothing more than links that call the other exe's from the main executable (IS360.exe).


My friend and me did some test on both 2 programs. Firstly, let's talk about the File Delete too.

The tool from Malwarebytes is just like KillBox, it used an Windows API to delete the locked file when Windows starts next time. But we found that the tool from IS360.exe is different. It can delete the file without reboot computer and user can only unlock but not delete the file. I think its idea if from Unlocker but not Malwarebytes. The program closes the handle from the running process that is using the file to be deleted, then the program can delete the file. So it's different. Also, Malwarebytes is made by Visual Basic and IS360 is made by Delphi, different source code.

The second question is the database, I think they stolen the database, but the program is different. As I said, these 2 program were made by two different builder, VB and Delphi, they cannot use Malwarebytes source code.

I still think that the issue is the database itself.

#208 exile360

exile360

    exile

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 16,013 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:42 AM

Have you ever tried the standalone version of FileASSASSIN upon which the FileASSASSIN tool in Malwarebytes' Anti-Malware is based? It's very similar to what you describe?

As for converting various languages to Delphi, I just googled convert c to delphi and got plenty of hits, including some freeware/open source tools and some hits from download.com so it would appear that program language translation isn't that difficult to come by.
Samuel E Lindsey
Product Manager

Posted Image

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook

#209 DragonMaster Jay

DragonMaster Jay

    True Member

  • Honorary Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 379 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:46 AM

Regarding IOBit 360: did anyone (including Jim G) ever happen to notice that aside from the actual scanner and the file deletion tool (2 features I commented as being similar to MBAM), all of the other "tools" are seperate exe's? Why if they were trying to make one comprehensive program, would there be a need for seperate executables for each one?

I submit as a possibility that they stole the code from the other softwares I mentioned and partially rewrote each one into a seperate executable and then bundled it all together with nothing more than links that call the other exe's from the main executable (IS360.exe).


It is usually bad practice to bundle all EXE's, instead of it all being combined in to one interface, because it slows down the computer it is running on.

Yes, I noticed that. I am looking at the VM I am running IObit on, and I can see all the executables.

List of Executables started in Processes when IObit Security 360 launches:

is360.exe ('USER')
is360tray.exe ('USER')
is360srv.exe (SYSTEM)

==

All executables:

is360.exe
is360tray.exe
is360srv.exe
a_hijackscan.exe | Hijack Scan
b_securityholes.exe | Security Holes
c_passivedefense.exe | Passive Defense
d_powerfuldelete.exe | Unlock & Delete
e_privacysweeper.exe | Privacy Sweeper
f_pctuneup.exe | PC Tuneup
is360updater.exe
unins000.exe

#210 exile360

exile360

    exile

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 16,013 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:50 AM

By the way, here is the page for FileASSASSIN.
Samuel E Lindsey
Product Manager

Posted Image

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook

#211 AdvancedSetup

AdvancedSetup

    Staff

  • Root Admin
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 40,978 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:US

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:51 AM

@Jim G

I fully support your idea to express your opinion and ideas, however at this point the banter between you and a couple other long time members is no longer offering anything more than useless chit chat. Please take this offline between each other if you wish to continue. Further posting on this subject by you will result in at least a temporary ban from the forum so please take this as a kind warning.

All others please also discontinue said discussion concerning this suject with Jim G. You are free to post or add information not related to this same discussion though. This posting is here to present a view and information, not to carry on an argument or grudge match between individuals.


Thank you.

Ron Lewis
Forum Community Manager

staff.png

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook


#212 Jim G

Jim G

    New Member

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 32 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:55 AM

Have you ever tried the standalone version of FileASSASSIN upon which the FileASSASSIN tool in Malwarebytes' Anti-Malware is based? It's very similar to what you describe?

As for converting various languages to Delphi, I just googled convert c to delphi and got plenty of hits, including some freeware/open source tools and some hits from download.com so it would appear that program language translation isn't that difficult to come by.


Yes, I did the test. When I use Malwarebytes to delete a running program, I got the below message:

"The file could not be delete. Your computer needs to be restarted to complete the removal process. Would you like to continue?"

Another side, when I use IS360 to delete the running file, it will analyze which program is using it first, then it will delete the file without reboot. So, the principle is absolutely different, and then they cannot use the same source code to implement different function, right?

#213 Jim G

Jim G

    New Member

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 32 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:56 AM

@Jim G

I fully support your idea to express your opinion and ideas, however at this point the banter between you and a couple other long time members is no longer offering anything more than useless chit chat. Please take this offline between each other if you wish to continue. Further posting on this subject by you will result in at least a temporary ban from the forum so please take this as a kind warning.

All others please also discontinue said discussion concerning this suject with Jim G. You are free to post or add information not related to this same discussion though. This posting is here to present a view and information, not to carry on an argument or grudge match between individuals.


Thank you.


OK, sorry for that. I will stop post in this thread now.

#214 Kenny94

Kenny94

    Malware Fighter

  • Experts
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,655 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:S.C USA
  • Interests:The workings of Apple's tablets and all PC'S

    Computing is not about computers any more. It is about living.
    ~Nicholas Negroponte

Posted 17 November 2009 - 08:37 AM

Back in June 2009 I tested Iobit Security 360 Beta at the time: http://www.remove-ma...t...22&start=30

Well, the thread there speaks for itself.
My Blog On Malware And Security Tips

My help is free, however, if you wish to make a small donation to show appreciation and to help me continue the fight against Malware, then click the PayPal button Posted Image

#215 evilfantasy

evilfantasy

    Advanced Member

  • Honorary Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 168 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Tulsa, OK

Posted 17 November 2009 - 11:50 AM

Arguments like that, no matter if you are right or wrong, just makes everyone look bad...

#216 Beenthere

Beenthere

    Regular Member

  • Honorary Members
  • PipPip
  • 75 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 12:45 PM

Make a good GUI and less error code, everytime when I scan my computer, there is an error code.

This is bullshit and it's probably something wrong at your side.
There's nothing wrong with the GUI and I have been using MBAM for more than a year now, did like 100 scans, and I never received an error code. Honesty, I don't know the looks of an error code in MBAM.

Also, it's not open source project, how can they get the code?

I hope you aren't serious. If you are, than you don't know much about cracking/programming/debugging and stuff

IP addresses must be different, because they communicate binary numbers.

The fact that IP addresses are actually binary numbers has nothing to do with their uniqueness.

#217 AdvancedSetup

AdvancedSetup

    Staff

  • Root Admin
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 40,978 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:US

Posted 17 November 2009 - 01:00 PM

@Beenthere,

Please see my post above and discontinue posting on the exact same subject with regards to Jim G, and please tone down your posting tone.

Thank you.

Ron Lewis
Forum Community Manager

staff.png

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook


#218 marktreg

marktreg

    Elite Member

  • Trusted Advisors
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 834 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:44 PM

Well, I may as well add my two cents worth. MBAM set a 'fictitious definitions' trap, and IOBit fell straight into it - hook, line and sinker. And now IOBit are trying to squirm their way out of it by any means possible. If I see an IOBit product on any of my customer's machines, I always recommend that they uninstall it and use MBAM instead. That is all.

#219 nosirrah

nosirrah

    Forum Deity

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,451 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Northampton, MA USA

Posted 17 November 2009 - 02:59 PM

For now lets drop the speculation . Anyone that wants to get a pile of samples and test MBAM and IOBit (v1.1 , 1.2 and 1.3) can do so and draw their own conclusions . As far as the code goes Malwarebytes never made the accusation that code was reversed or ported -- we only claimed database contents were stolen .
Bruce Harrison
Vice President of Research

Posted Image

Follow us: Twitter, Become a fan: Facebook

#220 wildman

wildman

    New Member

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 25 posts

Posted 17 November 2009 - 05:47 PM

I wasn't trying to excuse IObit. :)

Just saying that we shouldn't hold the download sites to the same accountability as IObit.


What is your definition of a thief? What does the term aiding and abetting mean to you? I rest my case.

Thanks
Wildman




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users